[NP-Clinical] Clinical Spirituality

Thu Aug 16 11:54:50 PDT 2007

I would respectfully disagree with you Paula, just in the spirit of open discussion, because I think a response like that would only feed into her self-doubts and guilt. Perhaps a provider could only say it if they are not completely sure that the mother's guilt is unjustified--but I do personally believe that no amount of devout religious behavior has any magical ability to prevent this sort of catastrophe. I would be perfectly comfortable, if she consulted me as a knowledgeable health professional, that I could authoritatively tell her she had absolutely no culpability. This person is torturing herself needlessly and I would wish for her to stop suffering as soon as possible.

Stephanie Walker, FNP

----- Original Message -----
From: Paula Sumner 
Date: Wednesday, August 15, 2007 11:41 pm
Subject: Re: [NP-Clinical] Clinical Spirituality
To: NP Clinical 

> I think I would reflect it back to her "You feel that if you 
> were good enough that you child would not be ill?" Or, "what I 
> am hearing you say and please correct me if I am wrong, you are 
> feeling responsible for her illness?"
> 
> You can be honest and say the illness is from.... if she admits 
> that she feels responsible -not good enough--and say this is not 
> an area that you feel comfortable with and offer to call a 
> chaplain to speak with her. Even if she says not to call the 
> chaplain to speak with her, ask if the chaplain came be called 
> to pray with her and with her child, most will accept this 
> offer. And a skilled chaplain will be able to draw her out and 
> support her. If she says yes or no, you can offer to pray with 
> her, it can be silent or out loud-you'd be surprised how much 
> patients and families appreciate that their nurses and doctors 
> would pray with them.
> Paula
> 
> Phil Noe wrote: 
> Ok-Here's an interesting spiritual / religious clinical
> question -> How would you handle this scenario? I
> recently say a child with a chronic incurrable and life
> shortening illness. The mom who is very involved in her
> local congregation carried a good bit of guilt and told
> me that as she studied her Religious book she believed
> that if she could lead a good enough life that her child
> would be cured but she had not achieved that yet was
> still trying. She obviously felt that the illness was
> somewhat her fault. After telling me this , she then
> paused for me to reply - what would you say?
> 
> Phil Noe
> Pediatric Pulmonology and Sleep Medicine
> Children's Hospital
> Knoxville, TN
> 
> 
> --- Calif NP wrote:
> 
> > There are numerous health care providers who
> > deliberately or unwittingly
> > unrelentlessly proselytize to their patients, often in
> > subtle ways such as
> > verbalizing religion based quotes or offering prayer
> > for someone's
> > difficulties (a kind gesture which I appreciate). But,
> > it is compelling that
> > we support the ethic that in a society based on secular
> > respect for others
> > beliefs this may not be appropriate, especially in
> > areas/populations which
> > are medically underserved.
> > 
> > ----- Original Message ----- 
> > From: "Dena" 
> > To: "'NP Clinical'" 
> > Sent: Monday, August 13, 2007 6:20 AM
> > Subject: RE: OT Re: [NP-Clinical] Prayer subject not
> > closed -
> > Prayforworldsobriety
> > 
> > 
> > > I'm sorry-- perhaps I've misunderstood the purpose of
> > this professional NP
> > > listserve after 13+ yrs of being an active member....
> > I had no idea I had
> > > signed up for a "religious NP" listserve. Or perhaps
> > the mission statement
> > > of the list changed somewhere along the line when I
> > was out of town. Or
> > > perhaps the official Email announcing the changes
> > ended up in my junk mail
> > > box and I just never saw it. Or perhaps newer members
> > are just ignorant of
> > > common proper netiquette because it isn't spelled out
> > in big bold letters
> > > somewhere. If this list had a moderator/administrator
> > (I nominate Andy!!),
> > > I'm sure these discussions would not be allowed.
> > >
> > > This is NOT the platform to discuss PERSONAL
> > religious beliefs-- of ANY
> > > kind... I'm sure there are other, more appropriate,
> > venues for that.
> > Perhaps
> > > those that are interested in exchanging prayers and
> > religious ideology can
> > > form their own listserve on NPCentral and leave this
> > one to its intended
> > > purpose???
> > >
> > > The ONLY time I think religion and politics have any
> > place on the list is
> > AS
> > > THEY APPLY TO PATIENT CARE AND RESTRICTION OF OUR OWN
> > PRACTICE and then it
> > > should be as IMPERSONAL as possible. The two subjects
> > are very sensitive
> > and
> > > volatile and people's feelings can too easily get
> > hurt. It's just NOT
> > > necessary. I could care less about the personal
> > religious beliefs of
> > ANYONE
> > > on this listserve-- it is immaterial to NPInfo and
> > NP-Clinical. I find it
> > > real hard to believe that some on this list actually
> > believe their own
> > > personal religious views have any bearing on
> > discussions of NP issues-- or
> > > that others care to hear about it.
> > > Dena Galler
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: np-clinical-bounces at nurse.net
> > [mailto:np-clinical-bounces at nurse.net]
> > > On Behalf Of Joanne DaCunha
> > > Sent: Monday, August 13, 2007 3:20 AM
> > > To: NP Clinical
> > > Subject: RE: OT Re: [NP-Clinical] Prayer subject not
> > closed - Pray
> > > forworldsobriety
> > >
> > > Interesting that it is NOT ok to post a prayer but
> > perfectly OK to
> > > ridicule that same religion. Perhaps I should not
> > express my view, but
> > > religion, or lack thereof, is part of one's culture,
> > just as any other
> > > part of their beliefs. It's not something that anyone
> > should ignore to
> > > be a whole person. I happen to not agree that
> > religion and politics
> > > should NOT be out of the social discussion context. I
> > think it teaches
> > > all of us how to have civilized discourse with those
> > with whom we
> > > disagree and allows disallows those who intend to
> > disrupt the beliefs of
> > > others to continue their efforts "underground"
> > without ever being
> > > challenged. Putting those issues on the discussion
> > table allows each of
> > > us to learn the beauty of others' culture and beliefs
> > and learn what we
> > > need to understand and live respectfully with others,
> > and that is a good
> > > thing.
> > > Joanne
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: np-clinical-bounces at nurse.net
> > > [mailto:np-clinical-bounces at nurse.net] On Behalf Of
> > Linda Marie De Zago
> > > Sent: Sunday, August 12, 2007 11:20 PM
> > > To: 'NP Clinical'
> > > Subject: RE: OT Re: [NP-Clinical] Prayer subject not
> > closed - Pray for
> > > worldsobriety
> > >
> > > Love it!!!
> > > This is going in my favorite folder.
> > > What a great way to end the weekend.
> > > Thanks for the laugh.
> > >
> > > Linda
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: np-clinical-bounces at nurse.net
> > > [mailto:np-clinical-bounces at nurse.net]
> > > On Behalf Of np at c-zone.net
> > > Sent: Sunday, August 12, 2007 10:40 PM
> > > To: NP Clinical
> > > Subject: OT Re: [NP-Clinical] Prayer subject not
> > closed - Pray for world
> > > sobriety
> > >
> > > Politically Incorrect Humor Warning!!!
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Read on at your own eternal peril, read on at the
> > risk of.........
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > "SIPPING VODKA"
> > >
> > > A new priest at his first mass was so nervous he
> > could hardly speak.
> > > After mass he asked the monsignor how he had done. 
> > The monsignor
> > > replied, "When I am worried about getting nervous On
> > the pulpit, I put a
> > > glass of vodka next to the water glass. If I start to
> > get nervous, I
> > > take a sip."
> > > So next Sunday he took the monsignor's advice. At
> > the beginning of the
> > > sermon, he got nervous and took a drink.
> > > He proceeded to talk up a storm. Upon his return to
> > his office after
> > > the mass, he found the following note on the door:
> > >
> > > 1) Sip the vodka, don't gulp.
> > >
> > > 2) There are 10 commandments, not 12.
> > >
> > > 3) There are 12 disciples, not 10
> > >
> > > 4) Jesus was consecrated, not constipated.
> > >
> > > 5) Jacob wagered his donkey, he did not bet his ass.
> > >
> > > 6) We do not refer to Jesus Christ as the late J.C.
> > >
> > > 7) The Father, Son, and Holy Ghost are not referred
> > to as Daddy, Junior
> > > and the spooky.
> > > 8) David slew Goliath, he did not kick the sh*t out
> > of him.
> > >
> > > 9) When David was hit by a rock and was knocked off
> > his donkey, don't
> > > say he was stoned off his ass.
> > >
> > > 10)We do! not refer to the cross as the "Big T."
> > >
> > > 11) When Jesus broke the bread at the last supper he
> > said, "take this
> > > and eat it for it is my body." He did not say " Eat
> > me"
> > >
> > > 12 The recommended grace before a meal is not:
> > Rub-A-Dub-Dub 
> === message truncated ===
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> 
> Paula J. Sumner RN, MSN, HTP, CHt
> Healing Touch, Hypnotherapy, Emotional Freedom Technique, Reiki-2
> 3500 Westgate Dr., Suite 504-G
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> 919-490-4656, 8#
> 
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> 
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> 
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> 
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