[NPInfo] Pri-Med Physician Workshop Proposal

[Stephanie Walker]

Alfredo,

I think you have a great idea. Again, I don't intend to sound like a  
wet blanket.

I have no problem paying for a CE event that has no ties to Big  
Pharma, or the companies that make DEXA scanners or ABI doppler  
gadgets, and then push disease screening for inappropriate  
populations using "educational" events. I am so uncomfortable  
attending these events anymore, more especially since so much media  
attention has been focused on them that patients allude to them in a  
cynical way, all the time. The general public has more awareness of  
this issue than most providers, I find.

Good luck with Pri Med. Since the box lunch they give attendees is so  
mediocre, maybe you could tempt them to leave the Pri Med venue and  
go to the restaurant next door for a free meal/lunch workshop &  
networking event--a competing event. They might stay on and not go  
back to Pri Med for the rest of the afternoon. But you'd have to make  
it worth their while (just joking).

Stephanie

On Jan 5, 2008, at 8:42 PM, Alfredo Bimbela wrote:

> Hi Stephanie,
>
> I do understand and see your points regarding the wedding of  
> presentations and product promotion/sponsorship.
>
> I propose that we strive to create an opportunity for physicians to  
> attend a workshop that offers what appears to be missing in most,  
> if not all, physician formal education. That is, we can sponsor a  
> workshop that addresses the benefits, complexities, challenges,  
> rewards, and considerations associated with working with nurse  
> practitioners and physician assistants.
>
> Let's wait to get a solid rejection before we consider Plan B.
>
> The initial workshop may involve asking interested physicians to  
> pay a small fee, provided that Pri-Med is willing to offer the  
> space for the talk but no funding. The first talk may require  
> asking speakers to volunteer time in order to begin what may or may  
> not be a historical event that brings sound to the silent  
> relationship between nurse practitioners and physicians that I  
> witness at every Pri-Med conference. We all walk around the  
> conference halls with no formal voice or real presence. However, I  
> did see a MinuteClinic booth at one of the conferences, so perhaps  
> there is slow change taking place.
>
> Right now we have representatives in Sacramento, CA talking to  
> Arnold Swarzenager about the role of NPs with respect to healthcare  
> reform. Let's continue to show, by example, our willingness and  
> commitment to build healthcare through strengthening our  
> relationships with physicians.
>
> In states such as California, we need to work closely with  
> physicians and it is in our best interest to create working  
> opportunities for both nurse practitioners and physicians.
>
> Let's give Pri-Med representatives the opportunity to consider the  
> idea. It will be a barometer of a few things, regardless of the  
> response.
>
> Alfredo
> --------------------------------------------------
> www.bimbelapublications.com
> www.bimbela.com
>
>
>
>
> Stephanie Walker <stephanie2u at optonline.net> wrote:
> As you are suggesting a presentation which does not promote a product
> (drug or device), and Pri Med is funded by the medical industrial
> complex (Big Pharma and device manufacturers) to promote their
> products in the guise of educational talks, it seems as though you
> would need a drug company to put up the money for your presentation.
>
> For instance, the company that makes Valtrex would be glad to sponsor
> a talk about HSV as long as Valtrex is featured as a treatment of
> choice. And in order to get their sponsorship you may have to push
> something unethical like screening all your patients for asymptomatic
> HSV in order to have a lot of reasons to write more Valtrex
> prescriptions.
>
> Pri Med is totally marketing, from my experiences there. I went once
> and I would never go again. It's totally devoted to sales talks. You
> get sold on the product in the sessions, then you go to the exhibit
> area and get detailed by the reps for the product. Then you're a
> believer and you write lots of prescriptions for their product,
> because some doctor giving the talk says he's a believer. Of course,
> the company is paying him to say that. I have no respect for the
> doctors who give talks at Pri Med. They are the paid creatures of the
> drug companies and get their slide set from the drug reps.
>
> It's worse than having reps come to the office and use up your lunch
> time giving you deli sandwiches and making you listen to their
> detailing unless you can go sit at your desk and eat your lunch
> there. With Pri Med, you have to drive yourself to some big hotel
> during rush hour, find a parking lot and fight the crowds to get a
> crummy box lunch and listen to detailing all day long. The little
> gadgets where you push a button to answer multiple choice questions
> are creepy and a Big Brotherish way to help program you to their  
> agenda.
>
> I'm not trying to be a wet blanket but it does seem that you have to
> promise to promote some product to get through the door and reach the
> Pri Med audience as a speaker. There's no free lunch.
>
> Stephanie Walker, FNP
>
>
> On Jan 5, 2008, at 6:39 PM, Alfredo Bimbela wrote:
>
> > A few thoughts and ideas about initiating this Pri-Med Workshop
> > Proposal:
> >
> > Pri-Med Workshop Proposal:
> >
> > 1. I will work towards finalizing the proposal and email it to
> > anyone who is interested in reviewing the content, focus, and frame
> > of the workshop. My goal is to make it clear, simple, relevant, and
> > tailored for physicians. The objective is to bring the information
> > that physicians want/need to know about working with nurse
> > practitioners and physician assistants.
> >
> > Presenters: NP, PA, and Physician
> >
> > Identify Appropriate Pri-med Committee Contacts:
> >
> > 2. Does anyone know any Pri-Med committee members particularly
> > members who may have a say in setting the agenda/curriculum? We
> > need to identify a point person who is willing and interested in
> > reviewing the proposal and bringing it to the Pri-Med committee
> > members.
> >
> > I am thinking of approaching someone from UCLA, since I am an
> > alumni of this program.
> >
> > As you can see from the West Coast Course Committee, we do have
> > two individuals nurseing representatives on the panel, though not
> > from UCLA (see the underlined members below):
> > Sanjiv Chopra MD, FACP
> > Director, Harvard Medical School Course Development Committee
> > Harvey P. Katz MD
> > Deputy Director, Pri-Med Course Development
> > Jane S. Sillman MD
> > Assistant Professor of Medicine
> > John D. Goodson MD
> > Frank Domino MD
> > Martin Shapiro MD, PhD
> > Martin A. Quan MD
> > Randy Wertheimer MD
> > Karen J. Carlson MD
> > Assistant Professor of Medicine
> > Harvard Medical School, Boston,MA
> > Maryjoan D. Ladden PhD, RN
> > Assistant Professor of Ambulatory Care and Prevention
> > Harvard Medical School, Boston,MA
> > Mark D. Aronson MD
> > Harvard Medical School, Boston,MA
> > Gerald W. Smetana MD
> > Harvard Medical School, Boston,MA
> > Rick E Harrison
> > David Geffen School of Medicine at UCLA, Los Angeles,CA
> > Sharon Steinberg MS, RN, CS
> > Lecturer in Ambulatory Care and Prevention
> > Care/ Prevention, Ex-Officio Member Harvard Pilgram Health Care,
> > Boston,MA
> > Patrick Dowling MD
> > David Geffen School of Medicine at UCLA, Los Angeles,CA
> >
> > Representation and Support
> >
> >
> >
> > 3. The strength of this Pri-Med Workshop Proposal will be based,
> > at least partially, on whether there is NP, PA, and MD/DO support
> > for it. It will be helpful to have at least a few sentences of
> > support from NPs, PAs, and MD/DOs. As you know, the Pri-Med
> > Committee will likely want to know whether NPs/PAs/MDs/DOs will
> > attend this workshop.
> >
> > The evidence of support does not need to be beyond sending me a
> > few names and addresses so that I can then attach it to the
> > proposal. The Pri-Med contact person can then bring the proposal to
> > the Pri-Med committee members with some evidence of support for the
> > workshop.
> >
> > Note: At the last Pri-Med, I did ask a few physicians,
> > informally, whether or not they would attend such as a workshop.
> > The majority said yes and the others proceeded to ask me questions
> > about the scope of practice and background information about nurse
> > practitioners, almost confirming the need for the workshop.
> >
> > Alfredo
> > ---------------------------------------------
> > www.bimbelapublications.com
> > www.bimbela.com
> >
> > "You have not failed until you have failed to try"
> >
> >
> > David Mittman wrote:
> > Alfredo: HGow about the American College of Clinicians joining your
> > effort?
> > I could run by the Board!??
> > Dave
> >
> > On Jan 5, 2008, at 3:20 PM, Alfredo Bimbela wrote:
> >
> >> Hi,
> >>
> >> I am drafting a proposal that serves to invite/encourage Pri-Med
> >> Representatives to sponsor/support a workshop for physicians who
> >> are interested in developing/building a practice with nurse
> >> practitioners and physician assistants.
> >>
> >> I am not sure whether I will get any response or support, but it
> >> will not be for lack of trying on my part.
> >>
> >> If anyone has any suggestions or ideas on this topic, please let
> >> me know.
> >>
> >> Alfredo
> >>
> >> Michael Zychowicz wrote:
> >> v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} o\:* {behavior:url
> >> (#default#VML);} w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} .shape
> >> {behavior:url(#default#VML);} st1\:*{behavior:url
> >> (#default#ieooui) }st2\:*{behavior:url
> >> (#default#ieooui) } Alfredo,
> >>
> >> Nice professional comments. Good job representing NPs
> >> professionally.
> >>
> >> I agree with your point that we need to be a little more internet
> >> savvy and get more info out there about our NP profession on You-
> >> Tube and other platforms. I am actually going to bring it up with
> >> my next NY state NP Association Board of Directors meeting.
> >>
> >> Mike
> >>
> >>
> >> Michael E. Zychowicz, DNP, RNFA, NP-C, FAANP
> >>
> >> Associate Professor of Nursing
> >>
> >> Nurse Practitioner
> >>
> >> Mount Saint Mary College
> >>
> >> 330 Powell Avenue
> >>
> >> Newburgh, NY 12550
> >>
> >> (845) 569-3144 (Office)
> >>
> >> (845) 569-3360 (Fax)
> >>
> >> www.msmc.edu
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> ---------------------------------
> >>
> >> From: Alfredo Bimbela [mailto:bimbelaa at yahoo.com]
> >> Sent: Friday, January 04, 2008 6:16 PM
> >> To: mzychowicz at hvc.rr.com; NP Info
> >> Subject: RE: [NPInfo] What a NP can do - RE: PA Video
> >>
> >>
> >> I posted my comments in the section located below the video
> >> clip. However, I did not go into detail about any portion of the
> >> video because I did not want my observations to create division and
> >> distance between our professions. Here is what I wrote,
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> "It is always difficult to know the scope of practice,
> >> educational background, prescriptive authority, and overall
> >> preparation of other disciplines. Overall, except for one or two
> >> inaccurate points about NPs, this video is great. I am always
> >> advocating for physician assistant and nurse practitioner synergy
> >> because we have more in common than people would like to admit.
> >> Have a nice New Year everyone."
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> I think we need more nurse practitioner youtube videos
> >> promoting and representing our profession - one from each state
> >> would do it.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Alfredo
> >>
> >>
> >> -------------------
> >>
> >> www.bimbelapublications.com
> >>
> >> www.bimbela.com
> >>
> >>
> >> Michael Zychowicz wrote:
> >>
> >> If you take a look on the u-tube I think there is a spot for a
> >> "rebuttal" or
> >> something like that. I would encourage anyone who thinks this  
> info is
> >> incorrect to say so on there.
> >>
> >> Michael E. Zychowicz, DNP, RNFA, NP-C, FAANP
> >> Associate Professor of Nursing
> >> Nurse Practitioner
> >> Mount Saint Mary College
> >> 330 Powell Avenue
> >> Newburgh, NY 12550
> >> (845) 569-3144 (Office)
> >> (845) 569-3360 (Fax)
> >> www.msmc.edu
> >>
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: npinfo-bounces at nurse.net [mailto:npinfo-bounces at nurse.net] On
> >> Behalf
> >> Of Alfredo Bimbela
> >> Sent: Friday, January 04, 2008 4:16 PM
> >> To: NP Info
> >> Subject: Re: [NPInfo] What a NP can do - RE: PA Video
> >>
> >> You ask, "What did she say about NPs that was inaccurate?"
> >>
> >> A few points are worth noting about the PA video:
> >>
> >> 1. First, in reference to selecting a career, she states that she
> >> wanted
> >> to do something in between "a nurse" and "physician...so I wanted
> >> something
> >> in between". She does not make any distinction about between nurse
> >> practitioners and registered nurses, suggesting that physician
> >> assistant
> >> career represents the "in between" career, implying that "a nursing
> >> career
> >> does not". Minor point but presents an inaccurate picture to those
> >> viewing
> >> the video.
> >>
> >> 2. She says, "One thing that is very different between a physician
> >> assistant and nurse practitioner is that when you become a nurse
> >> practitioner, you decide what sub-specialty you are going to go
> >> into...once
> >> you graduate with OBGYN, you are not allowed to practice anything
> >> outside of
> >> that". Misleading and inaccurate.
> >>
> >> 3. She says, "every six years, I believe we are the only field that
> >> has to
> >> re-certify" -Inaccurate.
> >>
> >> 4. There were other small details but are not worth mentioning. One
> >> of the
> >> PAs in the comment section already commented on a few.
> >>
> >> The reason I am drawing attention to these fine points is because
> >> this is
> >> what is out there for people considering careers, particularly
> >> those student
> >> who are deciding between a career as an NP and PA and MD.
> >>
> >> Now, had she had said that the NP profession is all over the place
> >> with
> >> state to state variability - I would have to say she is on the mark
> >> and has
> >> been staying informed about the NP profession :))
> >>
> >> Overall, I think she attempted to answer some very difficult
> >> questions
> >> that many of use, as NPs, find difficult to answer with clarity.
> >>
> >>
> >> Alfredo
> >> www.bimbelapublications.com
> >> www.bimbela.com
> >>
> >> David Mittman wrote:
> >> OK. Maybe it's my mood. I do not agree with all that this PA said.
> >> She I bet is not a 20 year veteran but she seems quite competent. I
> >> actually think that for someone who is in plastics for a few years
> >> she is OK. What did she say about NPs that was inaccurate? I  
> thought
> >> she was pretty spot on and never degrating. Her point was that ALL
> >> PAs are trained as generalists while most NPs were more vertically/
> >> specialty trained,that all PAs were generalists first. Maybe we are
> >> talking apples and oranges here but I think that's true. That's why
> >> many states license NPs by specialty, FNP, ANP, PNP, GNP. PAs are
> >> licensed as PAs and never by specialty? Clearly we specialize but
> >> that is done later.
> >> Also we started the ACC because we knew that NPs and PAs did not
> >> understand each other. We have done much to remedy that. Help me as
> >> to why this is innaccurate?
> >> Cyberhugs,
> >> Dave
> >> PS Watching ER and Jeannie the PA is back for one episode. Seems  
> she
> >> is running 2 clinics now and is divorced and a Mom. Who just  
> gave her
> >> the low down on all that she missed in the ER? The nurses....
> >> I am half watching though. Oh, oh she just found out her son has  
> AIDS
> >> (brain tumor).
> >>
> >>
> >> On Jan 3, 2008, at 7:35 PM, Alfredo Bimbela wrote:
> >>
> >>> This is we wrote the publication "PHYSICIANS: What You Need to  
> Know
> >>> to Work with a Nurse Practitioner ". The book is tailored
> >>> specifically for physicians about what they want to know about
> >>> nurse practitioners. It is simple and to the point on many issues.
> >>> Right now, I am working to bring this publication to members of
> >>> the AMA.
> >>>
> >>> We have to be proactive and diligent in bringing the information
> >>> to physicians and not wait for physicians to do the leg work.
> >>>
> >>> Another forum that we can use is youtube.com.
> >>>
> >>> If you want to hear an inaccurate description by a PA about nurse
> >>> practitioners, view the following:
> >>>
> >>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3yFYnFakxM
> >>>
> >>> This is not to pick on this particular PA, but it serves to
> >>> illustrate that professionals struggle with learning about nurse
> >>> practitioners.
> >>>
> >>> Just my thoughts,
> >>>
> >>> Alfredo
> >>>
> >>> "suernfnp at iwon.com" wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Alfredo, I agree with you that most docs still do not understand
> >>> what a NP can bring to their practice. I left my hospital position
> >>> today and took a full time job with my retail clinic. One of the
> >>> docs I work with at the hospital asked why I was leaving and I  
> said
> >>> "because you didn't offer me a job" joking a little with him. He
> >>> answered seriously, "I can't afford to pay you!" I told him he
> >>> needed to reframe the idea and think how much money I could EARN
> >>> for his practice. But he still doesn't get it.
> >>>
> >>> Sue D in MI
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
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> >>> NPInfo at nurse.net
> >>> http://lists.nurse.net/mailman/listinfo/npinfo
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> >>>
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> >>>
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