From emarcz at earthlink.net  Tue Oct  5 16:52:19 2004
From: emarcz at earthlink.net (E  Marciczkiewicz)
Date: Tue, 5 Oct 2004 19:52:19 -0400
Subject: [PrvPracNP] NP Practice acts & private practice
References: <cd.16d68471.2e7a1837@aol.com>
Message-ID: <002301c4ab36$5f3c7d80$932cfea9@minenml0wgc2g2>

Dear Laura,

I read your email with interest because i am planning to move towards a specialty in psych/pharm.  I work for a primary care practice which specializes in people with serious physical disabilities & often those come with serious psych comorbidity.  We often have frustrating team meetings revolving around patients who refuse to come in to see a psychiatrist to get med recommendations.

I'd like to be able to fill that gap, as well as to be able to do therapy and have been planning to do a post-certificate in psych.  

I guess my question for you is:  what should i look for in our state's nurse practice act in order to make this a good decision on my part?  I'm in Massachussetts.  And if it's going to be too much of a fight/issue i'm not up for it.  Although i feel so strongly about providing such services...

Thanks, 
Ava Marciczkiewicz, NP
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: LauraHoemanARNP at aol.com 
  To: prvpracnp at nurse.net 
  Sent: Wednesday, September 15, 2004 6:12 PM
  Subject: [PrvPracNP] NP Practice acts & private practice


  I opened my private practice in psych. 8 months ago and although some days it drives me crazy, I'm glad I did it and wouldn't do anything else.  In Washington state, we have one of the best NP practice acts, so I don't have to have any of those pesky (pricey) MDs involved if I don't want to.  I'm  getting very busy and although still not making as much money as I used to when I was an employee, the potential is greater. Anyway, I think it's mostly do to our NP practice act that I'm doing as well as I am. I encourage anyone who's thinking about private practice to work on NP practice/legislative action in their state. It makes all the difference. --Laura 


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From psumner2 at yahoo.com  Wed Oct  6 15:29:28 2004
From: psumner2 at yahoo.com (Paula J. Sumner)
Date: Wed, 6 Oct 2004 15:29:28 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [PrvPracNP] NP Practice acts & private practice
In-Reply-To: <002301c4ab36$5f3c7d80$932cfea9@minenml0wgc2g2>
Message-ID: <20041006222928.3192.qmail@web51607.mail.yahoo.com>

Ava,
I am an FNP and did the CNS psych route so I could have a private prACtice. In NC< I have to have an MD back up as an NP but not as a CNS. But, I cannot prescribe as a CNS. My problrm is I was not a psych nurse, and I don't pass the the sample tests in the study book I bought-the questions are really nuanced for institutional psych care, that if I answer the way  want-it is not how a phsych nurse would answer, so I have not taken the cer exam yet. It is frustrating, I should have take the Licensed Professional Counsellor training. Non-nursing, and would dhave given me more independence. Maybe you have that option in your state.? At least psych NP will get you the clinical edge you need to pass the exams I think.  Paula

E Marciczkiewicz <emarcz at earthlink.net> wrote:
Dear Laura,
 
I read your email with interest because i am planning to move towards a specialty in psych/pharm.  I work for a primary care practice which specializes in people with serious physical disabilities & often those come with serious psych comorbidity.  We often have frustrating team meetings revolving around patients who refuse to come in to see a psychiatrist to get med recommendations.
 
I'd like to be able to fill that gap, as well as to be able to do therapy and have been planning to do a post-certificate in psych.  
 
I guess my question for you is:  what should i look for in our state's nurse practice act in order to make this a good decision on my part?  I'm in Massachussetts.  And if it's going to be too much of a fight/issue i'm not up for it.  Although i feel so strongly about providing such services...
 
Thanks, 
Ava Marciczkiewicz, NP
----- Original Message ----- 
From: LauraHoemanARNP at aol.com 
To: prvpracnp at nurse.net 
Sent: Wednesday, September 15, 2004 6:12 PM
Subject: [PrvPracNP] NP Practice acts & private practice


I opened my private practice in psych. 8 months ago and although some days it drives me crazy, I'm glad I did it and wouldn't do anything else.  In Washington state, we have one of the best NP practice acts, so I don't have to have any of those pesky (pricey) MDs involved if I don't want to.  I'm  getting very busy and although still not making as much money as I used to when I was an employee, the potential is greater. Anyway, I think it's mostly do to our NP practice act that I'm doing as well as I am. I encourage anyone who's thinking about private practice to work on NP practice/legislative action in their state. It makes all the difference. --Laura 

---------------------------------


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http://lists.nurse.net/mailman/listinfo/prvpracnp
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PrvPracNP mailing list
PrvPracNP at nurse.net
http://lists.nurse.net/mailman/listinfo/prvpracnp
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Paula Joan Sumner RN, MSN, CFNP
Hypnotherapist, Healing Touch Practitioner, Emotional Freedom Technique
For Peak Performance Issues, Stress Management, Pain Management, Weight Management and  Smoking Cessation.
Durham, NC 27707

http://paulajsumner.byregion.net  reference# 10102918
http:/www.geocities.com/energy_healing4you

919-490-4656, #8
		
---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Get it on your mobile phone.
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From pamme at sbcglobal.net  Wed Oct  6 16:46:30 2004
From: pamme at sbcglobal.net (Pr. Pamela A. Provost N.P.)
Date: Wed, 6 Oct 2004 18:46:30 -0500
Subject: [PrvPracNP] Regarding PSY NP Courses
Message-ID: <00bc01c4abfe$ba1c8290$209cfea9@VAIO>

Hey Ava,
I had a private practice in Indiana and I didn't have either the CNS nor the Psy/MH NP certification.  Regardless, I needed a back up doc.  My friends, who are Licensed Professional Counselors, have to have psychologists as supervisors, not collaborators, not back ups, but as SUPERVISORS.    Check your state regs regarding this factor.
I was going to take the Psych/MH NP post grad certificate course.  As I had my own private practice and a back-up doc, I wanted the extra certification, only because the reimbursement was getting sticky.  One PPO asked when I was going to sit for the certification or when I had obtained it.  If I had not answered when, they would not have certified me.  That is the only reason that I want to take the course.  
I CAN tell you that the course you are going to take at USA, focuses on psychotherapy, as that is the main portion that is missing from the FNP course.  The FNP course, has some psychotherapy focus, but not as indepth as they do in their PSY/MH NP track.  They get more into the psychologists and the different styles of therapy in the Psych NP track.  They don't get that much into meds, except for the basic, what is an atypical for, why not use a typical vs atypical; why are anticonvulsants used, which is the only anticonvulsant sanctioned by the FDA for bipolar yada, yada, yada.  The course is not focused on the institutional nurse's role as it is an NP and not a CNS course.
Therein, Paula brings up a good point!!  There are many MSN courses for advanced practice out there that are focused on the CNS role and one really needs to read the curriculum to find out exactly what the purpose of the degree or the certificate course focus is.  The USA course, requires that you have an NP or a psychiatrist as a preceptor.  They expect you to cover private practice, group and inpatient experience.  The focus is on one to one therapy and prescribing.  However, the other specifics are covered to pass the exam.  
I took the sample questions and passed with flying colors.  Why?  I remembered all the crappy stuff I had to learn in my FNP Masters (no offense intended to those who enjoy theory and all that it entails).
And, having minored in Psych for my BS many years ago, I remembered much of whose theory covered what (of course we also covered that in my undergrand nursing and again in the FNP course) and also had kept up on it with my work with psychologists in my private practice.  
So, you can rest assured, that the course work you will receive at USA for the psych NP course, will enable you to practice with knowledge all that you need to know.  And, depending on your state, you will not have to be SUPERVISED, like you would if you went for a LMHP, unless of course, you have your doctorate and have applied for independent practice in your state (that is how it is done with psychologists in Indiana.  They have to apply for what is called an HSPP, in order to practice indepently.  No doctorate, no HSPP, supervision is required.  MSN NP-C, collaboration required in Indiana, very little interaction with the collaborator, but you may have to pay the collaborator unless they are a friend of yours.  
Personally, I wouldn't want the LMHP.  I like to prescribe and trust me, you will still be doing counseling despite being a prescriber.  All depends on how you want to set up your practice and how much money you want to make.  Without the PsyNP, you're counseling only and in reality, you don't have time to prescribe as well and you don't make much jack without that doctorate as most of it goes to the psychologist with whom you contract.  Oh, the stories I could tell you LOL.
Later gator,
Pamme
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From pamme at sbcglobal.net  Wed Oct  6 16:49:14 2004
From: pamme at sbcglobal.net (Pr. Pamela A. Provost N.P.)
Date: Wed, 6 Oct 2004 18:49:14 -0500
Subject: [PrvPracNP] Warning:  Delete Email from NOrmand Herring
Message-ID: <00cb01c4abff$1c273c00$209cfea9@VAIO>

It is carrying a virus.  It was picked up by my EZ Trust AntiViral Program.
I am virus free.
Love,
Pamme
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From pamme at sbcglobal.net  Wed Oct  6 19:13:41 2004
From: pamme at sbcglobal.net (Pr. Pamela A. Provost N.P.)
Date: Wed, 6 Oct 2004 21:13:41 -0500
Subject: [PrvPracNP] NP Practice acts & private practice
References: <cd.16d68471.2e7a1837@aol.com>
	<002301c4ab36$5f3c7d80$932cfea9@minenml0wgc2g2>
Message-ID: <020901c4ac13$4920d0e0$209cfea9@VAIO>

I wish I could remember the names of the colleagues I met when I worked in CT, and they practiced in MA.  Most of them worked for groups around the Bay State Area in Springfield.
I had my own private practice here in Indiana.  As I was an FNP by certification and had done an externship in psych, prior to the ANCC sneaking in that certification that is primarily for CNS'.  I spent many years working in psych.  In CT, I worked for an NP owned psychiatric consultant firm.  We spent our time traveling around to the nursing homes and consulting on the psychiatric needs of the attending's patients. 99% of the time, they went along with our recommendations. The other 1% of the time, the LPN's in the nursing homes interfered with our treatment plans.    Many of the plans had to address psych and pain issues.  
When I moved to Indiana and went into private practice, that was all I did was to coordinate psych and pain.  When I closed my private practice due to my own severe long term chronic pain issues that had attack my immune system, I thought I was looking at being a bag lady or developing a plan.
I went back to being a real nurse (RN) as this job on a brand new pain/rehab acute hospital inpatient unit dropped in to my lap  *thank you God*. and I would be able to do what I had never in my life do, work a floor and work a floor at nights yet, 3 twelve hour shifts a week.  Then, an even more amazing thing happened, the Medical director found out about my back ground and offered me a second job as an NP on the unit as well.  I'd do a few H*P's after work, the medical type after the nursing type had already been completed along with the  PT, OP, ST and TR's had already been completed.  A quick physical, a few depression, anxiety, mania scales and MMSE's and pull out what the nurse's et al were not able to pull out of the patient.  Add to the treatment plan and develop my medication plan.  Call in for a psychotherapy consult as I already had done the pysch eval and away we go. The perfect blend of a job for me with very little static from the staff cuz I was also a staff RN and I had already pulled my weight on the floor.  The real test will come when I lead the patient conference.  The PT'S already have their backs up.  They have been running the floor.  And as far as I am concerned will continue to: as a rehab unit, has to have the PT's and OT's to prepare the patient for discharge.  The head PT is great and already a compatriot.  His eldest (in time working unit) PT has a huge, I am hot stuff, know it all on her shoulder.  To her, knowing that I minor in PT for one of my degrees, didn't help).
All in all, I am absolutely thrilled.  I get to do what I love best -- nursing.  And I also get to do what I love second -- Medicine.  Must have paid a boat load of dues for the Lord to bestow these gifts on me.

Check and see if Patti Kristensen is a member of her Illinois group.  I know she is a member of the AANP and you can contact her through there.  She practiced as an independent for a quite a while in Mass.   I met her as a roommate to one of the AANP annual academy meeting.  She loves to talk and teach.  I am sure she can fill you in on what your NPA states or at least point you in the right direction to talk to a Mass NP.  We don't have any Mass NP's in this group?
Take care of you!
Pamme

----- Original Message ----- 
  From: E Marciczkiewicz 
  To: Private Practice NPs 
  Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2004 6:52 PM
  Subject: Re: [PrvPracNP] NP Practice acts & private practice


  Dear Laura,

  I read your email with interest because i am planning to move towards a specialty in psych/pharm.  I work for a primary care practice which specializes in people with serious physical disabilities & often those come with serious psych comorbidity.  We often have frustrating team meetings revolving around patients who refuse to come in to see a psychiatrist to get med recommendations.

  I'd like to be able to fill that gap, as well as to be able to do therapy and have been planning to do a post-certificate in psych.  

  I guess my question for you is:  what should i look for in our state's nurse practice act in order to make this a good decision on my part?  I'm in Massachussetts.  And if it's going to be too much of a fight/issue i'm not up for it.  Although i feel so strongly about providing such services...

  Thanks, 
  Ava Marciczkiewicz, NP
    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: LauraHoemanARNP at aol.com 
    To: prvpracnp at nurse.net 
    Sent: Wednesday, September 15, 2004 6:12 PM
    Subject: [PrvPracNP] NP Practice acts & private practice


    I opened my private practice in psych. 8 months ago and although some days it drives me crazy, I'm glad I did it and wouldn't do anything else.  In Washington state, we have one of the best NP practice acts, so I don't have to have any of those pesky (pricey) MDs involved if I don't want to.  I'm  getting very busy and although still not making as much money as I used to when I was an employee, the potential is greater. Anyway, I think it's mostly do to our NP practice act that I'm doing as well as I am. I encourage anyone who's thinking about private practice to work on NP practice/legislative action in their state. It makes all the difference. --Laura 


----------------------------------------------------------------------------


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From emarcz at earthlink.net  Thu Oct  7 06:24:59 2004
From: emarcz at earthlink.net (E  Marciczkiewicz)
Date: Thu, 7 Oct 2004 09:24:59 -0400
Subject: [PrvPracNP] NP Practice acts & private practice
References: <60.45c5dc08.2e94e525@aol.com>
Message-ID: <004a01c4ac71$0c0829c0$932cfea9@minenml0wgc2g2>

Thanks to all of you for all your input.  It's very helpful as i sort through all the info and choices.  I want to make sure i'm going down the right road when i finally do embark on this journey!

Best,
Ava
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: LauraHoemanARNP at aol.com 
  To: emarcz at earthlink.net 
  Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 2004 2:05 AM
  Subject: Re: [PrvPracNP] NP Practice acts & private practice


  Ava,  I would look for how much independence you have.  For example, in Washington state we do not need any supervision or collaboration with a physician at all. If we want to prescribe schedule II-IV, as most of us do, we need a very loose agreement with a physician, but we don't ever need to see or talk to the physician. We can even buy this collaboration on the internet. I pay $20 per month to a psychiatrist and for that I meet with a group of psych NPs once a month, for an hour. The psychiatrist gives us a lecture and we ask questions. She does not look at our charts.  I mention the money because in some states MDs are committing highway robbery in charging NPs for supervision.  So what you want to avoid in the nurse practice act is the need for an MDs supervision or collaboration just to practice.  If you need that, the MD may scalp you financially.  As a well-educated NP, you want and deserve independence and autonomy.  We have it in Washington state, and I wouldn't settle for less.  In Wash. state, because we do not NEED supervision or collaboration to practice, the MDs can't charge exorbitant fees.  We can bill insurance for just about as much as a psychiatrist.  It's a good place to be.  So, I guess I'm bragging about how good we have it here, but I also hope NPs in all states will get eventually the independence we have here.  Studies show we deserve it!  --Laura 
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From SamaraFNP at aol.com  Thu Oct  7 06:46:48 2004
From: SamaraFNP at aol.com (SamaraFNP at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 7 Oct 2004 09:46:48 EDT
Subject: [PrvPracNP] Re: PrvPracNP Digest, Vol 8, Issue 1
Message-ID: <127.4c36e1a9.2e96a2c8@aol.com>

I cannot figure out how to unsubscribe but I want to. please
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From pamme at sbcglobal.net  Thu Oct  7 13:46:57 2004
From: pamme at sbcglobal.net (Pr. Pamela A. Provost N.P.)
Date: Thu, 7 Oct 2004 15:46:57 -0500
Subject: [PrvPracNP] NP Practice acts & private practice
References: <60.45c5dc08.2e94e525@aol.com>
	<004a01c4ac71$0c0829c0$932cfea9@minenml0wgc2g2>
Message-ID: <02cf01c4acae$cf4c5630$209cfea9@VAIO>

Let us know how it all turns out Ava.
You have amassed a fan club here that is interested in your wellbeing
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: E Marciczkiewicz 
  To: LauraHoemanARNP at aol.com ; prvpracnp at nurse.net 
  Cc: Pr. Pamela A. Provost N.P. ; Paula J. Sumner 
  Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2004 8:24 AM
  Subject: Re: [PrvPracNP] NP Practice acts & private practice


  Thanks to all of you for all your input.  It's very helpful as i sort through all the info and choices.  I want to make sure i'm going down the right road when i finally do embark on this journey!

  Best,
  Ava
    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: LauraHoemanARNP at aol.com 
    To: emarcz at earthlink.net 
    Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 2004 2:05 AM
    Subject: Re: [PrvPracNP] NP Practice acts & private practice


    Ava,  I would look for how much independence you have.  For example, in Washington state we do not need any supervision or collaboration with a physician at all. If we want to prescribe schedule II-IV, as most of us do, we need a very loose agreement with a physician, but we don't ever need to see or talk to the physician. We can even buy this collaboration on the internet. I pay $20 per month to a psychiatrist and for that I meet with a group of psych NPs once a month, for an hour. The psychiatrist gives us a lecture and we ask questions. She does not look at our charts.  I mention the money because in some states MDs are committing highway robbery in charging NPs for supervision.  So what you want to avoid in the nurse practice act is the need for an MDs supervision or collaboration just to practice.  If you need that, the MD may scalp you financially.  As a well-educated NP, you want and deserve independence and autonomy.  We have it in Washington state, and I wouldn't settle for less.  In Wash. state, because we do not NEED supervision or collaboration to practice, the MDs can't charge exorbitant fees.  We can bill insurance for just about as much as a psychiatrist.  It's a good place to be.  So, I guess I'm bragging about how good we have it here, but I also hope NPs in all states will get eventually the independence we have here.  Studies show we deserve it!  --Laura 
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From GIN11153 at aol.com  Tue Oct 12 00:34:43 2004
From: GIN11153 at aol.com (GIN11153 at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 12 Oct 2004 03:34:43 EDT
Subject: [PrvPracNP] Doctor of Nursing Practice degree
Message-ID: <1a1.2a85179b.2e9ce313@aol.com>

Found this on the Medical Economics site:
========================================================
New competition from NPs? 
Pending New York State approval, Columbia University's School of Nursing 
plans to offer a doctoral degree for advanced practice nurses. The Doctor of 
Nursing Practice (DrNP) program will prepare candidates for independent care. The 
program would include classroom courses, supervised practice, and residency. 
Graduates would then be able to care for patients in an outpatient office, 
evaluate their needs in the ED, admit and co-manage hospitalized patients, provide 
advice and treatment over the phone while taking call, initiate specialist 
referrals, and evaluate the subsequent advice. The post-master's program would be 
two years, including one year of residency, while the post-baccalaureate 
program will be four years, plus one year of residency. The DrNP could be 
conferred in any specialty of advanced practice. 
While the AMA supports collaborative practice between NPs and physicians, the 
organization opposes independent practice. Moreover, the combination of Dr 
and NP is likely to be confusing to patients, says AMA Trustee Rebecca Patchin. 
============================================================

Gail Neuman RNC CPHW SNP LNC
listowner of LegalNurseConsulting at yahoogroups.com
certified high risk OB/legal consultant
Tustin, CA
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From jenbeth at bellsouth.net  Tue Oct 12 03:17:04 2004
From: jenbeth at bellsouth.net (Jenny Mullen)
Date: Tue, 12 Oct 2004 05:17:04 -0500
Subject: [PrvPracNP] Doctor of Nursing Practice degree
In-Reply-To: <1a1.2a85179b.2e9ce313@aol.com>
References: <1a1.2a85179b.2e9ce313@aol.com>
Message-ID: <416BAF20.5090909@bellsouth.net>

Awesome Ginny!  Thank you for sending this to me!  Pleases let me know 
if you hear more!!!
I leave for Orlando today for CME.  I'll be back next Monday.
It's all classes, so probably no Disney World...sigh*
But that could change!!!!!!! :-D
love you!
Jenny

GIN11153 at aol.com wrote:

>
>     Found this on the Medical Economics site:
>
> ========================================================
>
>
>     New competition from NPs?
>
> Pending New York State approval, Columbia University's School of 
> Nursing plans to offer a doctoral degree for advanced practice nurses. 
> The Doctor of Nursing Practice (DrNP) program will prepare candidates 
> for independent care. The program would include classroom courses, 
> supervised practice, and residency. Graduates would then be able to 
> care for patients in an outpatient office, evaluate their needs in the 
> ED, admit and co-manage hospitalized patients, provide advice and 
> treatment over the phone while taking call, initiate specialist 
> referrals, and evaluate the subsequent advice. The post-master's 
> program would be two years, including one year of residency, while the 
> post-baccalaureate program will be four years, plus one year of 
> residency. The DrNP could be conferred in any specialty of advanced 
> practice.
>
> While the AMA supports collaborative practice between NPs and 
> physicians, the organization opposes independent practice. Moreover, 
> the combination of Dr and NP is likely to be confusing to patients, 
> says AMA Trustee Rebecca Patchin.
>
> ============================================================
>  
> Gail Neuman RNC CPHW SNP LNC
> listowner of LegalNurseConsulting at yahoogroups.com
> certified high risk OB/legal consultant
> Tustin, CA
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>_______________________________________________
>PrvPracNP mailing list
>PrvPracNP at nurse.net
>http://lists.nurse.net/mailman/listinfo/prvpracnp
>% You can change you list options and unsubscribe from this page
>
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From jenbeth at bellsouth.net  Tue Oct 12 03:29:12 2004
From: jenbeth at bellsouth.net (Jenny Mullen)
Date: Tue, 12 Oct 2004 05:29:12 -0500
Subject: [PrvPracNP] oops
In-Reply-To: <416BAF20.5090909@bellsouth.net>
References: <1a1.2a85179b.2e9ce313@aol.com> <416BAF20.5090909@bellsouth.net>
Message-ID: <416BB1F8.6000602@bellsouth.net>

oops I thought this was my friend Ginny ~ and her private e-address.
my sincere apologies,
Jenny


> Awesome Ginny!  Thank you for sending this to me!  Pleases let me know 
> if you hear more!!!
> I leave for Orlando today for CME.  I'll be back next Monday.
> It's all classes, so probably no Disney World...sigh*
> But that could change!!!!!!! :-D
> love you!
> Jenny
>
> GIN11153 at aol.com wrote:
>
>>
>>     Found this on the Medical Economics site:
>>
>> ========================================================
>>
>>
>>     New competition from NPs?
>>
>> Pending New York State approval, Columbia University's School of 
>> Nursing plans to offer a doctoral degree for advanced practice 
>> nurses. The Doctor of Nursing Practice (DrNP) program will prepare 
>> candidates for independent care. The program would include classroom 
>> courses, supervised practice, and residency. Graduates would then be 
>> able to care for patients in an outpatient office, evaluate their 
>> needs in the ED, admit and co-manage hospitalized patients, provide 
>> advice and treatment over the phone while taking call, initiate 
>> specialist referrals, and evaluate the subsequent advice. The 
>> post-master's program would be two years, including one year of 
>> residency, while the post-baccalaureate program will be four years, 
>> plus one year of residency. The DrNP could be conferred in any 
>> specialty of advanced practice.
>>
>> While the AMA supports collaborative practice between NPs and 
>> physicians, the organization opposes independent practice. Moreover, 
>> the combination of Dr and NP is likely to be confusing to patients, 
>> says AMA Trustee Rebecca Patchin.
>>
>> ============================================================
>>  
>> Gail Neuman RNC CPHW SNP LNC
>> listowner of LegalNurseConsulting at yahoogroups.com
>> certified high risk OB/legal consultant
>> Tustin, CA
>>
>>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>PrvPracNP mailing list
>>PrvPracNP at nurse.net
>>http://lists.nurse.net/mailman/listinfo/prvpracnp
>>% You can change you list options and unsubscribe from this page
>>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>_______________________________________________
>PrvPracNP mailing list
>PrvPracNP at nurse.net
>http://lists.nurse.net/mailman/listinfo/prvpracnp
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>
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From pamme at sbcglobal.net  Tue Oct 12 12:03:27 2004
From: pamme at sbcglobal.net (Pr. Pamela A. Provost N.P.)
Date: Tue, 12 Oct 2004 14:03:27 -0500
Subject: [PrvPracNP] oops
References: <1a1.2a85179b.2e9ce313@aol.com> <416BAF20.5090909@bellsouth.net>
	<416BB1F8.6000602@bellsouth.net>
Message-ID: <005801c4b08e$28dccc60$209cfea9@VAIO>

I think I am missing something here Gail.  What would the Dr degree give us that we don't have know besides the title doctor?   I do all of that now.  At the age of 54, I don't know that I want to put out more expense just for the title, when I already have all the those privileges.
Love ya,
pame
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Jenny Mullen 
  To: jenbeth at bellsouth.net ; Private Practice NPs 
  Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2004 5:29 AM
  Subject: [PrvPracNP] oops


  oops I thought this was my friend Ginny ~ and her private e-address.
  my sincere apologies,
  Jenny



    Awesome Ginny!  Thank you for sending this to me!  Pleases let me know if you hear more!!!
    I leave for Orlando today for CME.  I'll be back next Monday.
    It's all classes, so probably no Disney World...sigh*
    But that could change!!!!!!! :-D 
    love you!
    Jenny

    GIN11153 at aol.com wrote:

      Found this on the Medical Economics site:
      ========================================================
      New competition from NPs? 
      Pending New York State approval, Columbia University's School of Nursing plans to offer a doctoral degree for advanced practice nurses. The Doctor of Nursing Practice (DrNP) program will prepare candidates for independent care. The program would include classroom courses, supervised practice, and residency. Graduates would then be able to care for patients in an outpatient office, evaluate their needs in the ED, admit and co-manage hospitalized patients, provide advice and treatment over the phone while taking call, initiate specialist referrals, and evaluate the subsequent advice. The post-master's program would be two years, including one year of residency, while the post-baccalaureate program will be four years, plus one year of residency. The DrNP could be conferred in any specialty of advanced practice. 

      While the AMA supports collaborative practice between NPs and physicians, the organization opposes independent practice. Moreover, the combination of Dr and NP is likely to be confusing to patients, says AMA Trustee Rebecca Patchin. 

      ============================================================

      Gail Neuman RNC CPHW SNP LNC
      listowner of LegalNurseConsulting at yahoogroups.com
      certified high risk OB/legal consultant
      Tustin, CA

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
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PrvPracNP mailing list
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From pamme at sbcglobal.net  Wed Oct 13 15:40:14 2004
From: pamme at sbcglobal.net (Pr. Pamela A. Provost N.P.)
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 2004 17:40:14 -0500
Subject: [PrvPracNP] Doctor of Nursing Practice degree
References: <1a1.2a85179b.2e9ce313@aol.com>
Message-ID: <00c201c4b175$9bbbc280$209cfea9@VAIO>

Hi ya Gail,
Where are their heads at.  We already practice independently in most states without such a program.  It's a nice short cut for obtaining a doctoral degree that usually takes 7 years, but I certainly don't need it for independent practice.  LOL.  
But I do have to admire their ingeniousness.  By taking that course, the NP would require to be addressed as Doctor.  Of course, as I told my friend who has a Phd and is an NP, I'd insist that the patients call her Doctor anyway.  Afterall, she is a doctor!!  LOL.
Love ya,
Pamme
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: GIN11153 at aol.com 
  To: IndNursePrac at yahoogroups.com ; prvpracnp at nurse.net ; npinfo at nurse.net 
  Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2004 2:34 AM
  Subject: [PrvPracNP] Doctor of Nursing Practice degree


  Found this on the Medical Economics site:
  ========================================================
  New competition from NPs? 
  Pending New York State approval, Columbia University's School of Nursing plans to offer a doctoral degree for advanced practice nurses. The Doctor of Nursing Practice (DrNP) program will prepare candidates for independent care. The program would include classroom courses, supervised practice, and residency. Graduates would then be able to care for patients in an outpatient office, evaluate their needs in the ED, admit and co-manage hospitalized patients, provide advice and treatment over the phone while taking call, initiate specialist referrals, and evaluate the subsequent advice. The post-master's program would be two years, including one year of residency, while the post-baccalaureate program will be four years, plus one year of residency. The DrNP could be conferred in any specialty of advanced practice. 

  While the AMA supports collaborative practice between NPs and physicians, the organization opposes independent practice. Moreover, the combination of Dr and NP is likely to be confusing to patients, says AMA Trustee Rebecca Patchin. 

  ============================================================

  Gail Neuman RNC CPHW SNP LNC
  listowner of LegalNurseConsulting at yahoogroups.com
  certified high risk OB/legal consultant
  Tustin, CA



------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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From csdlp at eiu.edu  Thu Oct 14 08:41:51 2004
From: csdlp at eiu.edu (Daphne Piercy)
Date: Thu, 14 Oct 2004 10:41:51 -0500
Subject: [PrvPracNP] Doctor of Nursing Practice degree
References: <1a1.2a85179b.2e9ce313@aol.com>
	<00c201c4b175$9bbbc280$209cfea9@VAIO>
Message-ID: <416E9E3F.1006740A@eiu.edu>

I think it may be a good idea.  It would minimize the rhetoric about education levels, both parties (MDs and NPs) would have Doctoral Degrees.  I am not an expert here, but I would think would need to approval from most state legislatures as a profession or extension of a profession.  This could lead to legislative changes that would otherwise take years to pass.  Ultimately it could solve much of the reimbursement issues and would hopefully lead to throwing out these collaborative agreements for good!

Read the Wall Street Journal October 11, 2004.  You can access the article online.  This situation has lead to very positive publicity for nurse practitioners.

Daphne - Illinois
"Pr. Pamela A. Provost N.P." wrote:

> Hi ya Gail,
> Where are their heads at.  We already practice independently in most states without such a program.  It's a nice short cut for obtaining a doctoral degree that usually takes 7 years, but I certainly don't need it for independent practice.  LOL.
> But I do have to admire their ingeniousness.  By taking that course, the NP would require to be addressed as Doctor.  Of course, as I told my friend who has a Phd and is an NP, I'd insist that the patients call her Doctor anyway.  Afterall, she is a doctor!!  LOL.
> Love ya,
> Pamme
>   ----- Original Message -----
>   From: GIN11153 at aol.com
>   To: IndNursePrac at yahoogroups.com ; prvpracnp at nurse.net ; npinfo at nurse.net
>   Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2004 2:34 AM
>   Subject: [PrvPracNP] Doctor of Nursing Practice degree
>
>   Found this on the Medical Economics site:
>   ========================================================
>   New competition from NPs?
>   Pending New York State approval, Columbia University's School of Nursing plans to offer a doctoral degree for advanced practice nurses. The Doctor of Nursing Practice (DrNP) program will prepare candidates for independent care. The program would include classroom courses, supervised practice, and residency. Graduates would then be able to care for patients in an outpatient office, evaluate their needs in the ED, admit and co-manage hospitalized patients, provide advice and treatment over the phone while taking call, initiate specialist referrals, and evaluate the subsequent advice. The post-master's program would be two years, including one year of residency, while the post-baccalaureate program will be four years, plus one year of residency. The DrNP could be conferred in any specialty of advanced practice.
>
>   While the AMA supports collaborative practice between NPs and physicians, the organization opposes independent practice. Moreover, the combination of Dr and NP is likely to be confusing to patients, says AMA Trustee Rebecca Patchin.
>
>   ============================================================
>
>   Gail Neuman RNC CPHW SNP LNC
>   listowner of LegalNurseConsulting at yahoogroups.com
>   certified high risk OB/legal consultant
>   Tustin, CA
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>   _______________________________________________
>   PrvPracNP mailing list
>   PrvPracNP at nurse.net
>   http://lists.nurse.net/mailman/listinfo/prvpracnp
>   % You can change you list options and unsubscribe from this page
>
>   ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> _______________________________________________
> PrvPracNP mailing list
> PrvPracNP at nurse.net
> http://lists.nurse.net/mailman/listinfo/prvpracnp
> % You can change you list options and unsubscribe from this page



From lam629 at comcast.net  Thu Oct 14 09:17:00 2004
From: lam629 at comcast.net (lori)
Date: Thu, 14 Oct 2004 12:17:00 -0400
Subject: [PrvPracNP] Doctor of Nursing Practice degree
References: <1a1.2a85179b.2e9ce313@aol.com><00c201c4b175$9bbbc280$209cfea9@VAIO>
	<416E9E3F.1006740A@eiu.edu>
Message-ID: <002701c4b209$3c927ee0$47722444@avenel01.nj.comcast.net>

Is this something that we would all be required to obtain?   I really do not
want to go back for a doctoral degree at least not right now.  Although if
this was offered when I started graduate school, I probably would have
seriously looked into it.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Daphne Piercy" <csdlp at eiu.edu>
To: "Private Practice NPs" <prvpracnp at nurse.net>
Sent: Thursday, October 14, 2004 11:41 AM
Subject: Re: [PrvPracNP] Doctor of Nursing Practice degree


> I think it may be a good idea.  It would minimize the rhetoric about
education levels, both parties (MDs and NPs) would have Doctoral Degrees.  I
am not an expert here, but I would think would need to approval from most
state legislatures as a profession or extension of a profession.  This could
lead to legislative changes that would otherwise take years to pass.
Ultimately it could solve much of the reimbursement issues and would
hopefully lead to throwing out these collaborative agreements for good!
>
> Read the Wall Street Journal October 11, 2004.  You can access the article
online.  This situation has lead to very positive publicity for nurse
practitioners.
>
> Daphne - Illinois
> "Pr. Pamela A. Provost N.P." wrote:
>
> > Hi ya Gail,
> > Where are their heads at.  We already practice independently in most
states without such a program.  It's a nice short cut for obtaining a
doctoral degree that usually takes 7 years, but I certainly don't need it
for independent practice.  LOL.
> > But I do have to admire their ingeniousness.  By taking that course, the
NP would require to be addressed as Doctor.  Of course, as I told my friend
who has a Phd and is an NP, I'd insist that the patients call her Doctor
anyway.  Afterall, she is a doctor!!  LOL.
> > Love ya,
> > Pamme
> >   ----- Original Message -----
> >   From: GIN11153 at aol.com
> >   To: IndNursePrac at yahoogroups.com ; prvpracnp at nurse.net ;
npinfo at nurse.net
> >   Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2004 2:34 AM
> >   Subject: [PrvPracNP] Doctor of Nursing Practice degree
> >
> >   Found this on the Medical Economics site:
> >   ========================================================
> >   New competition from NPs?
> >   Pending New York State approval, Columbia University's School of
Nursing plans to offer a doctoral degree for advanced practice nurses. The
Doctor of Nursing Practice (DrNP) program will prepare candidates for
independent care. The program would include classroom courses, supervised
practice, and residency. Graduates would then be able to care for patients
in an outpatient office, evaluate their needs in the ED, admit and co-manage
hospitalized patients, provide advice and treatment over the phone while
taking call, initiate specialist referrals, and evaluate the subsequent
advice. The post-master's program would be two years, including one year of
residency, while the post-baccalaureate program will be four years, plus one
year of residency. The DrNP could be conferred in any specialty of advanced
practice.
> >
> >   While the AMA supports collaborative practice between NPs and
physicians, the organization opposes independent practice. Moreover, the
combination of Dr and NP is likely to be confusing to patients, says AMA
Trustee Rebecca Patchin.
> >
> >   ============================================================
> >
> >   Gail Neuman RNC CPHW SNP LNC
> >   listowner of LegalNurseConsulting at yahoogroups.com
> >   certified high risk OB/legal consultant
> >   Tustin, CA
> >
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
> >
> >   _______________________________________________
> >   PrvPracNP mailing list
> >   PrvPracNP at nurse.net
> >   http://lists.nurse.net/mailman/listinfo/prvpracnp
> >   % You can change you list options and unsubscribe from this page
> >
>
  ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > _______________________________________________
> > PrvPracNP mailing list
> > PrvPracNP at nurse.net
> > http://lists.nurse.net/mailman/listinfo/prvpracnp
> > % You can change you list options and unsubscribe from this page
>
> _______________________________________________
> PrvPracNP mailing list
> PrvPracNP at nurse.net
> http://lists.nurse.net/mailman/listinfo/prvpracnp
> % You can change you list options and unsubscribe from this page



From csdlp at eiu.edu  Thu Oct 14 08:59:53 2004
From: csdlp at eiu.edu (Daphne Piercy)
Date: Thu, 14 Oct 2004 10:59:53 -0500
Subject: [PrvPracNP] Doctor of Nursing Practice degree
References: <1a1.2a85179b.2e9ce313@aol.com><00c201c4b175$9bbbc280$209cfea9@VAIO>
	<416E9E3F.1006740A@eiu.edu>
	<002701c4b209$3c927ee0$47722444@avenel01.nj.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <416EA279.5C9B9369@eiu.edu>

That is a good question.  I don't know.  But if some in the particular state had
sought their education in this new way.  It would be great if they made it a
standard for liscensure and gradfathered the rest (currently practicing NPs)
in.  When we passed legislation in Illinois, we grandfathered all practicing NPs
with certain criteria.  For example, some did not have a master's degree. Now,
all new NPs need to meet the new application for liscensure standards.

lori wrote:

> Is this something that we would all be required to obtain?   I really do not
> want to go back for a doctoral degree at least not right now.  Although if
> this was offered when I started graduate school, I probably would have
> seriously looked into it.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Daphne Piercy" <csdlp at eiu.edu>
> To: "Private Practice NPs" <prvpracnp at nurse.net>
> Sent: Thursday, October 14, 2004 11:41 AM
> Subject: Re: [PrvPracNP] Doctor of Nursing Practice degree
>
> > I think it may be a good idea.  It would minimize the rhetoric about
> education levels, both parties (MDs and NPs) would have Doctoral Degrees.  I
> am not an expert here, but I would think would need to approval from most
> state legislatures as a profession or extension of a profession.  This could
> lead to legislative changes that would otherwise take years to pass.
> Ultimately it could solve much of the reimbursement issues and would
> hopefully lead to throwing out these collaborative agreements for good!
> >
> > Read the Wall Street Journal October 11, 2004.  You can access the article
> online.  This situation has lead to very positive publicity for nurse
> practitioners.
> >
> > Daphne - Illinois
> > "Pr. Pamela A. Provost N.P." wrote:
> >
> > > Hi ya Gail,
> > > Where are their heads at.  We already practice independently in most
> states without such a program.  It's a nice short cut for obtaining a
> doctoral degree that usually takes 7 years, but I certainly don't need it
> for independent practice.  LOL.
> > > But I do have to admire their ingeniousness.  By taking that course, the
> NP would require to be addressed as Doctor.  Of course, as I told my friend
> who has a Phd and is an NP, I'd insist that the patients call her Doctor
> anyway.  Afterall, she is a doctor!!  LOL.
> > > Love ya,
> > > Pamme
> > >   ----- Original Message -----
> > >   From: GIN11153 at aol.com
> > >   To: IndNursePrac at yahoogroups.com ; prvpracnp at nurse.net ;
> npinfo at nurse.net
> > >   Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2004 2:34 AM
> > >   Subject: [PrvPracNP] Doctor of Nursing Practice degree
> > >
> > >   Found this on the Medical Economics site:
> > >   ========================================================
> > >   New competition from NPs?
> > >   Pending New York State approval, Columbia University's School of
> Nursing plans to offer a doctoral degree for advanced practice nurses. The
> Doctor of Nursing Practice (DrNP) program will prepare candidates for
> independent care. The program would include classroom courses, supervised
> practice, and residency. Graduates would then be able to care for patients
> in an outpatient office, evaluate their needs in the ED, admit and co-manage
> hospitalized patients, provide advice and treatment over the phone while
> taking call, initiate specialist referrals, and evaluate the subsequent
> advice. The post-master's program would be two years, including one year of
> residency, while the post-baccalaureate program will be four years, plus one
> year of residency. The DrNP could be conferred in any specialty of advanced
> practice.
> > >
> > >   While the AMA supports collaborative practice between NPs and
> physicians, the organization opposes independent practice. Moreover, the
> combination of Dr and NP is likely to be confusing to patients, says AMA
> Trustee Rebecca Patchin.
> > >
> > >   ============================================================
> > >
> > >   Gail Neuman RNC CPHW SNP LNC
> > >   listowner of LegalNurseConsulting at yahoogroups.com
> > >   certified high risk OB/legal consultant
> > >   Tustin, CA
> > >
> >
> > --------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ----
> > >
> > >   _______________________________________________
> > >   PrvPracNP mailing list
> > >   PrvPracNP at nurse.net
> > >   http://lists.nurse.net/mailman/listinfo/prvpracnp
> > >   % You can change you list options and unsubscribe from this page
> > >
> >
>   ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > PrvPracNP mailing list
> > > PrvPracNP at nurse.net
> > > http://lists.nurse.net/mailman/listinfo/prvpracnp
> > > % You can change you list options and unsubscribe from this page
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > PrvPracNP mailing list
> > PrvPracNP at nurse.net
> > http://lists.nurse.net/mailman/listinfo/prvpracnp
> > % You can change you list options and unsubscribe from this page
>
> _______________________________________________
> PrvPracNP mailing list
> PrvPracNP at nurse.net
> http://lists.nurse.net/mailman/listinfo/prvpracnp
> % You can change you list options and unsubscribe from this page



From pamme at sbcglobal.net  Thu Oct 14 17:27:38 2004
From: pamme at sbcglobal.net (Pr. Pamela A. Provost N.P.)
Date: Thu, 14 Oct 2004 19:27:38 -0500
Subject: [PrvPracNP] Doctor of Nursing Practice degree
References: <1a1.2a85179b.2e9ce313@aol.com><00c201c4b175$9bbbc280$209cfea9@VAIO>
	<416E9E3F.1006740A@eiu.edu>
Message-ID: <005701c4b24d$c778dfb0$209cfea9@VAIO>

I can see where you are coming from Daphne.  However, the grad school I went
to required a minimum of 2 years in the field before you would be accepted
to the grad NP program.  And of those two years, you had to have been well
rounded in practice with a minimum of 3 months of Public or Community
Health/Home Health.  Doctorates are great if you want one.  However, knowing
nursing as I do after all these many years, we'd end up with more of the
nursing theory and more of the focus towards theoretical practice and
nursing issues than the type of focused practice that we do as NP's.

I had 4 years for Bachelors of Science.
Followed by 2 years for an ADN.
Followed by 1 year of Bachelor specific nursing courses.
Followed by 10 years working in the field.
Followed by 1.75 yrs in grad school.
Followed by 6 months externship in each specialty.
Followed by a year practice in each externship.
And with a minimum of 30 CEU's each year (that is my specific goal set for
myself to remain current).

Frankly, I think that adds up to far more time than any MD has put into
training just to get an MD (that only requires 3 yrs undergrad and 3 yrs med
school in the advanced program that is now popular in most eastern schools.)
And doctors do not have to have so many CME's to continue to practice.  For
the first time ever, they are instituting a re-boarding for specialty
physicians after 10 years.  It has yet to go into effect (in psychiatry at
least).  Frankly, they are missing the boat and would be better off
following our example of CEU requirements.
Had I wanted to be a doctor, I would have saved myself sometime and done
that in the first place.

I think requiring a doctorate to do what we are already doing is caving to
the pressure.  It's just not necessary.  Education of the masses and those
sitting on the boards is what is required.  I, for one, have had enough
"formal" education and do not want to have to go backwards to practice as I
have done for years.

I hope I didn't sound too harsh.  I am not feeling at all well and had to
see my P.A. today for an exam and some new meds.

Namaste,
Pamme

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Daphne Piercy" <csdlp at eiu.edu>
To: "Private Practice NPs" <prvpracnp at nurse.net>
Sent: Thursday, October 14, 2004 10:41 AM
Subject: Re: [PrvPracNP] Doctor of Nursing Practice degree


> I think it may be a good idea.  It would minimize the rhetoric about
education levels, both parties (MDs and NPs) would have Doctoral Degrees.  I
am not an expert here, but I would think would need to approval from most
state legislatures as a profession or extension of a profession.  This could
lead to legislative changes that would otherwise take years to pass.
Ultimately it could solve much of the reimbursement issues and would
hopefully lead to throwing out these collaborative agreements for good!
>
> Read the Wall Street Journal October 11, 2004.  You can access the article
online.  This situation has lead to very positive publicity for nurse
practitioners.
>
> Daphne - Illinois
> "Pr. Pamela A. Provost N.P." wrote:
>
> > Hi ya Gail,
> > Where are their heads at.  We already practice independently in most
states without such a program.  It's a nice short cut for obtaining a
doctoral degree that usually takes 7 years, but I certainly don't need it
for independent practice.  LOL.
> > But I do have to admire their ingeniousness.  By taking that course, the
NP would require to be addressed as Doctor.  Of course, as I told my friend
who has a Phd and is an NP, I'd insist that the patients call her Doctor
anyway.  Afterall, she is a doctor!!  LOL.
> > Love ya,
> > Pamme
> >   ----- Original Message -----
> >   From: GIN11153 at aol.com
> >   To: IndNursePrac at yahoogroups.com ; prvpracnp at nurse.net ;
npinfo at nurse.net
> >   Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2004 2:34 AM
> >   Subject: [PrvPracNP] Doctor of Nursing Practice degree
> >
> >   Found this on the Medical Economics site:
> >   ========================================================
> >   New competition from NPs?
> >   Pending New York State approval, Columbia University's School of
Nursing plans to offer a doctoral degree for advanced practice nurses. The
Doctor of Nursing Practice (DrNP) program will prepare candidates for
independent care. The program would include classroom courses, supervised
practice, and residency. Graduates would then be able to care for patients
in an outpatient office, evaluate their needs in the ED, admit and co-manage
hospitalized patients, provide advice and treatment over the phone while
taking call, initiate specialist referrals, and evaluate the subsequent
advice. The post-master's program would be two years, including one year of
residency, while the post-baccalaureate program will be four years, plus one
year of residency. The DrNP could be conferred in any specialty of advanced
practice.
> >
> >   While the AMA supports collaborative practice between NPs and
physicians, the organization opposes independent practice. Moreover, the
combination of Dr and NP is likely to be confusing to patients, says AMA
Trustee Rebecca Patchin.
> >
> >   ============================================================
> >
> >   Gail Neuman RNC CPHW SNP LNC
> >   listowner of LegalNurseConsulting at yahoogroups.com
> >   certified high risk OB/legal consultant
> >   Tustin, CA
> >
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
> >
> >   _______________________________________________
> >   PrvPracNP mailing list
> >   PrvPracNP at nurse.net
> >   http://lists.nurse.net/mailman/listinfo/prvpracnp
> >   % You can change you list options and unsubscribe from this page
> >
>
  ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > _______________________________________________
> > PrvPracNP mailing list
> > PrvPracNP at nurse.net
> > http://lists.nurse.net/mailman/listinfo/prvpracnp
> > % You can change you list options and unsubscribe from this page
>
> _______________________________________________
> PrvPracNP mailing list
> PrvPracNP at nurse.net
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From pamme at sbcglobal.net  Thu Oct 14 17:37:17 2004
From: pamme at sbcglobal.net (Pr. Pamela A. Provost N.P.)
Date: Thu, 14 Oct 2004 19:37:17 -0500
Subject: [PrvPracNP] Doctor of Nursing Practice degree
References: <1a1.2a85179b.2e9ce313@aol.com><00c201c4b175$9bbbc280$209cfea9@VAIO><416E9E3F.1006740A@eiu.edu><002701c4b209$3c927ee0$47722444@avenel01.nj.comcast.net>
	<416EA279.5C9B9369@eiu.edu>
Message-ID: <006101c4b24f$2019d1a0$209cfea9@VAIO>

That's great to hear about Illinois.  Did that include NP's who moved into
the state from other places?
But most importantly, if the ANCC got a hold of it, like they have done with
the Psych NP board that they established on their own without consulting any
of the national NP organizations and before the competencies for Psych NP's
even existed, they would not allow anyone who has not obtained the doctorate
to sit for the board.  If you couldn't sit for the board, you couldn't get
reimbursement in IN for doing the same work.  AND, the ANCC is not allowing
any grandfathering at all. They did this very quietly without notifying
anyone in the field nor the national NP orgs of their intent.  This caused
me a tremendous amount of problems in practice in this state;  to the point
where I just got out of it, despite pleas from my colleagues not to abandon
psych  They felt (as did the psychiatrists and psychologists within my
collegial realm), that I was an "excellent" (their words, not mine believe
me) provider with a very well established outcome record of patient
remission and 0 suicide attempts/successes.
Now, if doctorates would be awarded to those of us who had already succeeded
in passing the boards and have had so many years of successful practice
(i.e., 3 years), with perhaps a minor paper presented for publishing based
on case studies, I'd consider it.
However, I think right now, it's a tempest in a teapot.
Namaste,
Pamme

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Daphne Piercy" <csdlp at eiu.edu>
To: "Private Practice NPs" <prvpracnp at nurse.net>
Sent: Thursday, October 14, 2004 10:59 AM
Subject: Re: [PrvPracNP] Doctor of Nursing Practice degree


> That is a good question.  I don't know.  But if some in the particular
state had
> sought their education in this new way.  It would be great if they made it
a
> standard for liscensure and gradfathered the rest (currently practicing
NPs)
> in.  When we passed legislation in Illinois, we grandfathered all
practicing NPs
> with certain criteria.  For example, some did not have a master's degree.
Now,
> all new NPs need to meet the new application for liscensure standards.
>
> lori wrote:
>
> > Is this something that we would all be required to obtain?   I really do
not
> > want to go back for a doctoral degree at least not right now.  Although
if
> > this was offered when I started graduate school, I probably would have
> > seriously looked into it.
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Daphne Piercy" <csdlp at eiu.edu>
> > To: "Private Practice NPs" <prvpracnp at nurse.net>
> > Sent: Thursday, October 14, 2004 11:41 AM
> > Subject: Re: [PrvPracNP] Doctor of Nursing Practice degree
> >
> > > I think it may be a good idea.  It would minimize the rhetoric about
> > education levels, both parties (MDs and NPs) would have Doctoral
Degrees.  I
> > am not an expert here, but I would think would need to approval from
most
> > state legislatures as a profession or extension of a profession.  This
could
> > lead to legislative changes that would otherwise take years to pass.
> > Ultimately it could solve much of the reimbursement issues and would
> > hopefully lead to throwing out these collaborative agreements for good!
> > >
> > > Read the Wall Street Journal October 11, 2004.  You can access the
article
> > online.  This situation has lead to very positive publicity for nurse
> > practitioners.
> > >
> > > Daphne - Illinois
> > > "Pr. Pamela A. Provost N.P." wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hi ya Gail,
> > > > Where are their heads at.  We already practice independently in most
> > states without such a program.  It's a nice short cut for obtaining a
> > doctoral degree that usually takes 7 years, but I certainly don't need
it
> > for independent practice.  LOL.
> > > > But I do have to admire their ingeniousness.  By taking that course,
the
> > NP would require to be addressed as Doctor.  Of course, as I told my
friend
> > who has a Phd and is an NP, I'd insist that the patients call her Doctor
> > anyway.  Afterall, she is a doctor!!  LOL.
> > > > Love ya,
> > > > Pamme
> > > >   ----- Original Message -----
> > > >   From: GIN11153 at aol.com
> > > >   To: IndNursePrac at yahoogroups.com ; prvpracnp at nurse.net ;
> > npinfo at nurse.net
> > > >   Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2004 2:34 AM
> > > >   Subject: [PrvPracNP] Doctor of Nursing Practice degree
> > > >
> > > >   Found this on the Medical Economics site:
> > > >   ========================================================
> > > >   New competition from NPs?
> > > >   Pending New York State approval, Columbia University's School of
> > Nursing plans to offer a doctoral degree for advanced practice nurses.
The
> > Doctor of Nursing Practice (DrNP) program will prepare candidates for
> > independent care. The program would include classroom courses,
supervised
> > practice, and residency. Graduates would then be able to care for
patients
> > in an outpatient office, evaluate their needs in the ED, admit and
co-manage
> > hospitalized patients, provide advice and treatment over the phone while
> > taking call, initiate specialist referrals, and evaluate the subsequent
> > advice. The post-master's program would be two years, including one year
of
> > residency, while the post-baccalaureate program will be four years, plus
one
> > year of residency. The DrNP could be conferred in any specialty of
advanced
> > practice.
> > > >
> > > >   While the AMA supports collaborative practice between NPs and
> > physicians, the organization opposes independent practice. Moreover, the
> > combination of Dr and NP is likely to be confusing to patients, says AMA
> > Trustee Rebecca Patchin.
> > > >
> > > >   ============================================================
> > > >
> > > >   Gail Neuman RNC CPHW SNP LNC
> > > >   listowner of LegalNurseConsulting at yahoogroups.com
> > > >   certified high risk OB/legal consultant
> > > >   Tustin, CA
> > > >
> > >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > ----
> > > >
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> > >
>
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